This is a transcript of SYS 469 – From Shorts To Features With Colin West .
Welcome to Episode 469 of the Selling Your Screenplay Podcast. I’m Ashley Scott Meyers, screenwriter and blogger with sellingyourscreenplay.com. Today I am interviewing writer-director Colin West, he just wrote and directed the new comedy feature film – Linoleum, starring Jim Gaffigan. We talked through this film and how it came together for him and we talked about some of the shorts and the super low budget feature film that he did before this latest film, so stay tuned for that interview.
SYS’s six-figure screenplay contest is open for submissions, just go to www.sellingyourscreenplay.com/contest. Our early bird deadline is March 31st. So, if your script is ready, definitely submit now to save some money. We’re looking for low budget shorts and features. I’m defining low budget as less than six figures. In other words, less than 1 million US dollars. We’ve got lots of industry judges reading the scripts and later rounds we’re giving away 1000s in cash and prizes. We’ve had number of options and sales from the contest. And this is only our fourth year. So, we’re getting some nice bit of traction with these scripts. It’s always a lot of producers looking for high quality low budget films. We have a short films script category 30 pages or less. So, if you have a short script, by all means submit that as well. If you want to submit to the contest, just go to sellingyourscreenplay.com/contest. Also, again this year, we’re running an in-person Film Festival in tandem with our screenplay contest. It’s for low budget films produced for less than 1 million US dollars. We have features and shorts category, the festival is going to take place in Hollywood, California from October 7th to the 15th. If you’ve produced a short film or know someone who has by all means please do submit it. If you have a finished film and would like to submit it or learn more about the contest, just go to our festival page, which is at sellingyourscreenplay.com/festival, you’ll see our Filmfreeway link there, we’re actually taking all of the film festival submissions through Filmfreeway. So, you can find us on there as well. If you find this episode valuable, please help me out by giving me a review in iTunes or leave a comment on YouTube or retweeting the podcast on Twitter or liking or sharing it on Facebook. These social media shares really do help spread word about the podcast, so they’re very much appreciated. Any websites or links that I mentioned in the podcast can be found on my blog in the show notes. I also publish a transcript with every episode in case you’d rather read the show or look at something later on. You can find all the podcast show notes at www.sellingyourscreenplay.com/podcast and then just look for episode number 469.
If you want my free guide How to Sell a screenplay in five weeks can pick that up by going to sellingyourscreenplay.com/guide. It’s completely free. Just put in your email address. And I’ll send you a new lesson once per week for five weeks along with a bunch of bonus lessons. Teach the whole process of how to sell your screenplay in that guide. Teach you how to write a professional logline and query letter, and how to find agents, managers and producers who are looking for material really is everything you need to know to sell your screenplay, just go to sellingyourscreenplay.com/guide. So, just a quick few words about what I’ve been working on. I’m still mostly spending my time plugging away on this NFT project for The Rideshare Killer, slow going but I am getting some PR actually have my second podcast interview scheduled for next week. It’s another one of these crypto podcast, I’d actually say the reaction I’ve gotten from the crypto people is more enthusiastic than I have from the film community. As I talk with some of these crypto folks, I have more and more convinced that I’m on the right path with how NFT’s and films will intersect. So, I am still pushing this along. And we’ll keep pushing it here for at least another couple of weeks. And it was that’s what I’ve mainly been working on. Now. Let’s get into the main segment. Today. I am interviewing writer-director Colin West. Here is the interview.
Ashley
Welcome Colin to the Selling Your Screenplay Podcast. I really appreciate you coming on the show with me today.
Colin West
Thank you glad to be here.
Ashley
So, to start out, maybe you can tell us a little bit about your background. Where did you grow up, and how did you get interested in the entertainment business?
Colin West
Sure. I grew up in Ohio, in Columbus, Ohio. And I got into filmmaking I like to sort of say, because I was really bad at playing soccer. And so, I didn’t make the soccer team. And all my friends did and so my mom was like, you should go to the library and get some books. And I went to the library, but instead of getting books, I got a whole bunch of movies and I sort of fell in love with filmmaking at that point at a young age. And one of the things that really stuck out to me that I watched early on was Darren Aronofsky’s first movie Pie. And, you know, this was, you know, in this was maybe the year 2000 or 1999, something like that. And so, I found Darren Aronofsky’s email address online because he had only released that one movie obviously he went on to make you know, Black Swan and you know, the wrestler, everything you know, these great films and I reached out in it and he emailed me back and was like; Hey, man, like and he actually gave me some screenwriting tips because I was like, how do I make movies? And he was like, you got to write a screenplay. So, I ended up writing my first script at like, at age 16. Like, and it was a total rip off of pie. But yeah, so that’s kind of how I fell in love with it. And then from there, yeah, I got into fine arts, a little bit painting and sculpture and stuff like that. And then kind of found my way back into narrative filmmaking. And as a little tidbit, before we get to that, speaking of like, growing up, so to two of my three producers, Chad Simpson, and Chad Harvell, also went to high school with me and graduated with me in my high school class. So, it kind of came back around full circle, to where now we’re all still working together, which is kind of insane.
Ashley
Yeah, yeah. Perfect. So, let’s talk about some of the shorts. I noticed on IMDb, you have a bunch of short films that you wrote and directed. Just talk a little bit about those. How did they prepare you for doing feature films? Do you recommend this as a path for writer directors?
Colin West
Yeah. I do. I mean, I think it’s sort of like it’s a place to experiment. You know, obviously, I don’t think there’s really a huge market per se for short film. So, in a lot of ways, it’s kind of training wheels, to figure out what you like, and how you shoot things and how you think about things. It’s sort of a, I think short films are a great kind of like creative, like, great creative process to sort of hone your own voice more than anything. You know, I think I experimented a lot. I learned a lot. I did a lot of different kinds of short films, you know, and music videos, commercial work, too. And all of that was kind of figuring out what I liked and what I don’t like and what I’m kind of good at and what I don’t feel like I’m very good at. So yeah, that’s I think the benefit of shorts.
Ashley
Yeah. Perfect. And how did you transition from shorts? It looked like Double Walker was your first feature credit, before Linoleum. So how did you transition from doing those shorts to actually doing a feature?
Colin West
I think I just kind of really impatient and decided to just go make a really sort of low budget feature that Double Walker, you know, was an incredibly low budget, film, I shot back in my hometown, and you know, pulled a lot of favors from friends and family back there and, you know, got, you know, those kind of like locations for free and stuff like that. And I deliberately, you know, I collaborated on that movie a lot with the star of the film and my co-writer, Sylvie Mix. And she and I kind of put together the story and, in a lot of ways, kind of motivated each other to, like, make this thing and really follow through. And I think like partnering up like that, especially like, when you’re sort of pursuing something very new and big and challenging. Oh, my God, it’s a feature film like that kind of a mind process or thought process like having a trusted collaborator like Sylvie was really, really helpful. We kind of helped each other through the process, you know, so that transition was a lot easier in that way.
Ashley
Perfect. Yeah, that’s sound advice, for sure. So, let’s dig into your latest film Linoleum starring Jim Gaffigan. To start out, maybe give us a quick pitch or logline, what does this film all about?
Colin West
Sure, it is about a failed children’s science TV show host like Bill Nye the Science Guy kind of character, who essentially tries to follow his dream of being an astronaut by building a rocket ship in his garage. And that’s a very sort of basic look at the movie, it gets much more kind of drawn out and complicated than that, in that like he all of these sort of questionable things start to happen in his reality, and he starts to try to sort of piece together what’s really happening. I think it has this kind of like Charlie Kaufman-esque like sensibility to it, and a lot of ways.
Ashley
And where did this idea come from? What was sort of the genesis of this story?
Colin West
Sure, the impetus of the story initially was kind of telling a kind of elevated or fantastic version of my grandparent’s love story, essentially, they met when they were 16. And were together for you know, over six decades until they passed away a few years back, and you know, kind of a subjective look back through memory in a lot of ways at a relationship, how it starts the kind of turmoil within the middle and how it ends. And so that was kind of yeah, the start of the story. It took me about five years to really hone in and make this thing it was, find the draft that was perfect. And in the meantime, I was writing other screenplays and things like that, but I couldn’t keep I just like had to get this one perfect and I had to keep coming back to my mind just would never let go of it. Like I think some other scripts that I’ve written I kind of forget about and in a way it’s a sign that like, maybe they’re not the ones that I need to be pursuing actually producing. But you know, this one, you know, just kind of kept like itching my brain and I kept making so many drafts and changes. So, it was quite a process for sure.
Ashley
So, we’re going to dig into that writing process now and talk about it a little bit, where do you typically write? Are you someone that writes at a home office? Do you need to start Starbucks with an ambient noise? And when do you typically write you know, morning? Do you write late at night? What is your writing schedule look like?
Colin West
Ashley, I got to say it’s like, so inconsistent. I like honestly, like, I wish, I really wish I could be somehow consistent with it. But like, some days I write in the mornings, and some days I write at night. And some days, I literally write in the middle of the night, like, my last script. Like the script that I have just recently written, which is like, hopefully one of my next projects I wrote in two days, but those two days were six months apart. And so like, I wrote, like 60 pages of a script one night, and then, like, waited six months, and then pick it back up and finish it another night, you know what I mean? Just like all night, and that’s not like necessarily normal. But what I’m saying it’s like, some scripts I write like that. And then scripts like Linoleum, like, it took me probably a year just to write the first draft. And I was working on it pretty much every day, like, you know, writing a page or two here and there and, you know, very slow process. So, I don’t know, I wish I had like a solid answer for you, actually.
Ashley
And to be honest with you, that is a solid answer, because we have lots of screenwriters on this podcast. And that’s sort of the point I’m trying to make is nobody’s process is exactly like somebody else’s process. And you find your own process through the doing just going through this process. What’s your take on outlining versus actually in Final Draft, writing script pages? Do you spend a lot of time doing index cards and outlining? And then once you’re in final draft, you have a pretty good idea where you’re going? Or do you sort of mess around in final draft?
Colin West
Sure, Ashley. Well, I actually don’t really love outlines, I think that they kind of like this, they make me not excited to actually sit down and write a page of the screenplay. I like writing outlines, but then it really just takes the magic away from me from writing the actual script itself. So, I would in this really like horrible way I think I would rather like spend a whole bunch of times just like writing and rewriting and rewriting, then like, outlining a perfect story, and then like going through and like very methodically writing each scene as I had outlined it. I just find it like, my creative brain turns off where I’m like, oh, I already know what’s happening next. So, I’m kind of bored of like, so I don’t know if it’s some kind of like ADHD kicking or something like that. But like, but I find like, yeah, outlines just take away the fun. So, I don’t really outline and I actually write in fate, and I don’t, I don’t even know how to use Final Draft. I feel like a bad screenwriter. I don’t know how to use Final Draft, but I always convert everything to these to fade in and then use that.
Ashley
Gotcha. What is your development process look like? Especially something like this that took you many years, you mentioned you had two friends from high school that also ultimately ended up producers. Were you guys talking about discovery, sending it out getting notes? Did you have some actors? Like what did that development process look like as you’re going along?
Colin West
Totally. Actually, I mean, it was probably a little bit different. Like, it was unique, because, you know, this is like the first like, “bigger budget movie” that like has, you know, something bigger actors and whatever. And that just means that it just takes longer to make like, you can’t sort of I couldn’t just greenlight it myself, like, I didn’t have multiple millions of dollars in my pocket to go just do that myself. So, you know, that process was new for me. But the producers that I that I joined up with Chad Simpson, Chad Herbold, like, it wasn’t their first rodeo. So, they helped a lot with like, getting the script out there and trying to find financiers and things like that, and we ended up finding like a very incredible guy who produced and funded the movie, Dennis Maisel, and he came in as a great sort of partner throughout the film making process. But I think that’s pretty unique in itself, too, because it was just one person who kind of put up all of the financing for the movie. So yeah, that was our process.
Ashley
Gotcha. And at what point did Jim Gaffigan come into the project? Was this you know, after five years of mulling over this script, then you’re able to bring him in? I’m always curious about when the actor the lead actor comes on to something like this.
Colin West
Sure. Well, our casting director, her name is Jessica Sherman. And she wasn’t incredible. And we actually was, we were working with her for about a year and a half trying to sort of secure actors. But you know, we didn’t have much of a track record right like I didn’t as a director as a writer, I hadn’t even made Double Walker at that point. You know, I shot Double Walker six months before I shot Linoleum. So, Linoleum was basically already greenlit, and then I went in shot Double Walker. So as far as like attaching Jim, he came on actually really late in the process. And the script was sort of through Jessica floating around Jim’s agency, UTA. And his agent had seen it and thought Jim might be a really great person for the role. And so, they kind of reached out to us and it was a really, yeah, I was like, immediately, like, oh, my god, yeah. Jim Gaffy, like he’s so good, and could be so perfect for this role. Or I should say, both roles, he plays two different roles in the movie. And so yeah, that’s kind of how the casting came about. It was a long process. I mean, you know, the first hire was a lawyer to draw up contracts with our casting director, and then we worked with our casting director for a year and a half to try to find people and the processes are always long, right? Because you can only go out to one person at a time. So, we would put out a letter and then wait for a month and then get back I know, or whatever. And this process just went on for quite a while.
Ashley
Yeah, yeah. I’ve been getting his stand up on Tik Tok. They’ve been feeding that. Yeah, he’s very funny. So, I look forward to seeing his career I think will really blossom, this will be a great role for him. So, what’s next for you? What are you working on now?
Colin West
Sure. Well, I mentioned that crazy script that I just wrote it, like, in one day, and then two days or whatever, you know, I’m very, very excited about that one. And then I have another couple of projects sort of like coming through the pipeline. I mean, you know, you’re talking about outlining, it’s really hard to sort of, like, sell an idea without outlining it. So, I am finding that, especially with sort of more, some of my more like, commercial driven ideas, like I have to outline because no one’s going to sort of fund the development process without me outlining first, they know what they’re getting into. Versus like me just specking a script, like I did with that this last one. So yeah, I definitely have like a few different things kind of like coming down the pipe. And it’s just sort of like seeing what, what clicks I mean, I think it’s always good to have multiple things coming,
Ashley
For sure. Is there anything you’ve seen recently that you thought was really great that you could recommend to our screenwriting audience? HBO, Netflix, Hulu, anything you’ve been watching recently?
Colin West
Yeah, sure. I’m a little behind on that White Lotus show. I’ve only watched the first season, but I really liked it and thought that the writing in particular was very, like, I love that kind of like ensemble nature of it. And Linoleum has a similar kind of thing. It’s sort of following all these different storylines, that sort of interweave, and I think it’s always inspiring to sort of see how brilliant writers can structure stuff like that. I mean, I had a really hard time not calling myself brilliant, but like I had a really hard time doing it. And so, to see White Lotus do it so effortlessly, I think is really great as a writer.
Ashley
Yeah, yeah, it’s a great recommendation. So how can people see Linoleum? Do you know what the release schedule is going to be like?
Colin West
Yeah, we finally do. So, we are releasing on February 24th. And the trailer actually just dropped today. So, everybody should go watch the trailer. And yeah, so it’ll be in theatres in on February 24th. And then soon after on streaming. So, keep an eye out.
Ashley
Perfect. Perfect. And what’s the best way for people to keep up with you and kind of follow along with your career? Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, anything you’re comfortable sharing, I’ll put in the show notes.
Colin West
Oh, cool. Um, yeah, sure. I mean, I guess Instagram kind of, I don’t really do to the social media stuff as much but um, but if they want to, they can follow me. I’ll post some things every once in awhile on Instagram. It’s at CollinCollinCollinCollin. That’s four Collins.
Ashley
Perfect. Perfect. Well, Colin, I really appreciate you coming on the show and talking with me. Good luck with this film and good luck. Well, your future projects as well.
Colin West
Thanks, Ashley. Appreciate it.
Ashley
Thank you. We’ll talk to you later.
Colin West
Bye
SYS’s from concept to completion screenwriting course is now available, just go to www.sellingyourscreenplay.com/screenwritingcourse. It will take you through every part of writing a screenplay, coming up with a concept outlining, writing the opening pages, the first act, second act, third act and then rewriting, and then there’s even a module at the end on marketing your screenplay once it’s polished and ready to be sent out. We’re offering this course in two different versions. The first version, you get the course plus you get three analyses from an SYS reader. You’ll get one analysis on your outline and then you’ll get two analyses on your first draft of your screenplay. This is just our introductory price. You’re getting three full analyses which is actually the same price as our three pack Analysis bundles. So, you’re essentially getting the course for free when you buy the three analyses that come with it. And to be clear, you’re getting our full analysis with this package. The other version doesn’t have the analysis. So, you’ll have to find some friends or colleagues who will do the feedback portion of the course with you. I’m letting SYS Select members do this version of the course for free. So, if you’re a member of SYS Select, you already have access to it. You also might consider that as an option. If you join SYS Select you will get the course as part of that membership too. A big piece of this course is accountability. Once you start the course, you’ll get an email every Sunday with that week’s assignment. And if you don’t complete it, we’ll follow up with another reminder the next week, it’s easy to pause the course if you need to take some time off. But as long as you’re enrolled, you’ll continue to get reminders for each section until it’s completed. The objective of the course is to get you through it in six months, so that you have a completed polished screenplay ready to be sent out. So, if you have an idea for a screenplay, and you’re having a hard time getting it done, this course might be exactly what you need. If this sounds like something you’d like to learn more about, just go to www.sellingyourscreenplay.com/screenwritingcourse, is all one word, all lowercase. I will of course a link to the course in the show notes and I will put a link to the course on the homepage up in the right-hand sidebar. On the next episode of the podcast, I’m going to be interviewing Ambus Lopez he is a Texas filmmaker who just did a cool horror film called Those Who Call. He got his start actually with a YouTube channel and making short horror films for YouTube. So, we talked about that a little bit. Ultimately, I guess he sold his YouTube channel is now branching out into features but it’s an interesting sort of way to get started in the film business. And as I said he lives and works in Texas outside of Houston. So, we talked about that a little bit as well. So, keep an eye out for that episode next week. That’s the show. Thank you for listening.